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| Formation flying http://thorp18.com/thorpforum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=8335 |
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| Author: | James Grahn [ Wed Mar 20, 2019 6:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Formation flying |
If anyone has a formation flying card (from FFI, Red Star, or anyone else), be advised that the FAA has rewritten the regs pertaining to formation flying in waivered airspace. As of 1 January, your card is only valid after taking a written exam. FFI has a short course and 26 question test available on their website. Cubes |
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| Author: | Jeff J [ Thu Mar 21, 2019 11:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
Good info, thanks. I wonder what ADS-B will do for formation flying. I have heard of controllers asking only lead aircraft to squawk but ADS-B will force all equipped aircraft to broadcast stacked signals if installed without an “off” switch as per my understanding of the regs. |
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| Author: | fytrplt [ Thu Mar 21, 2019 3:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
Not true. A formation is considered a single airplane for traffic control purposes. Also, the warnings from your wingman's xponder will drive you nuts. |
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| Author: | James Grahn [ Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
Transponder and ADSB are two separate deals. Not sure what ATC would be seeing if we both have ADSB on and in formation. I’ll ask. Cubes |
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| Author: | fytrplt [ Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
Basically, in my experience, they see two planes very close together. Not all ATCs are adsb capable, but flying around Atlanta, I have been asked to have my wing man strangle parrot. Seems the data blocks stack and are not readable. The aforementioned proximity warnings were distracting and constant. My system has no way to turn the warnings off. Wing man had to fly more than a mile away from me or change altitude by about 500 ft. As first installed, wingman's unit had no off switch. This was corrected on subsequent flights and all went well. If I went standby, ATC got the wrong call sign and really messed up the hand offs. Let us know what you find out, Cubes. |
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| Author: | Fraser MacPhee [ Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
I'm on a controller forum and threw out the question about formation and ADS-B just now. I hope they know that strangling the parrot isn't the same as choking the chicken!! |
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| Author: | fulcrumflyer [ Fri Mar 22, 2019 8:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
James Grahn wrote: If anyone has a formation flying card (from FFI, Red Star, or anyone else), be advised that the FAA has rewritten the regs pertaining to formation flying in waivered airspace. As of 1 January, your card is only valid after taking a written exam. FFI has a short course and 26 question test available on their website. Cubes YGTBSM!!! In my 23 years in the Air Force I never took a written test on formation flying. I wonder who came up with this lame idea. What's next? Written tests on takeoff and landing? Spanky |
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| Author: | fytrplt [ Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
Ease off, big fella. You only need the card for wavered airspace like airshows. Has to do with some unfortunate happenings in some mass flyovers. |
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| Author: | James Grahn [ Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
The whole light airplane formation team thing was really taking off when the military stopped or slowed their participation in flybys. Several teams got pretty wild and got in trouble. Remember this all happened right after the Ghost crashed at Reno and killed a bunch of folks. So the FAA, FFI, Red Star, FAST, and IAC got together to try to make this whole thing safer for our fans. I did the study and test on one overnight. It really isn’t hard. And, to be honest, I’m not sure we have many/any card holders anymore. But the fact that their are proficiency requirements and a test is not wildly known. I wanted to make sure those with cards knew about it. That is all Cubes |
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| Author: | Jeff J [ Fri Mar 22, 2019 1:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
Assuming you are referencing the Galloping Ghost crash, what does a flight control malfunction have to do with safer formation flying? I was under the impression all race pilots had to be formation qualified long before that crash because I remember pilots talking about getting checked out when I was still part of that scene (2010 was the last year I attended). |
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| Author: | James Grahn [ Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Formation flying |
After that crash, and a few close calls by light civilian formation teams, the FAA wanted to try to do something to protect the spectators. One of the biggest changes is maneuvering formation with regard to a vector towards the crowd line. A lot of stuff is now prohibited. That’s what the academics and test is all about. We are getting a bit far afield of the original intent of my post. I just wanted to let those folks, who are formation carded, know that there are new requirements. Cubes |
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