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Fraser MacPhee
 Post subject: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 1:08 pm 
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In the April addition of Sport Av, there is an article on "Sport Aviation Checkouts".....by Budd Davisson, who some of you know well. On page 76 just above the Cub photo, is a statement that kinda rattled my loom fruits......"Under FAA rules, a flight instructor certificate is not required for giving a checkout".......it does go on to list some assumptions such as giving a tailwheel endorsement or a rating.

Imagine that......as long as you have a tailwheel endorsement, any fartasaurus qual'd to captain a T-18 can check you out and sign you off........though I might not recommend it.....'nor I think would I (being a T-18 captain and certified fartasaurus) sign anyone off......

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Fraser MacPhee
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Rich Brazell
 Post subject: Re: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 3:56 pm 
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Frase...is that a Lawyer knocking at your front door ? ::) I think they are forming a line ! BOOM ! Time to get out the Roach Spray . :P

RB O0


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fytrplt
 Post subject: Re: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 8:55 pm 
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Type ratings are not required by the FAR's unless the plane is considered a large aircraft (or turbo). One doesn't need a "checkout' by anyone to operate a non-complex, non-high performance airplane. If one has the proper Class, Single Engine Land, on their Pilot Certificate and Endorsement, Tailwheel in their logbook, then they are good to go. Where the "Gotcha" occurs is when you go to insure such activities. The various insurance companies, based on their vast data (or whims), rate different types of planes and issue edicts of experience requirements in order to be covered. So, if a guy or gal wants to buy your plane, and has the proper ticket, he or she doesn't need a "checkout" to fly it away. Hint: make sure that they are the owner before letting such a thing occur.

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bjwest
 Post subject: Re: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 10:52 pm 
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I think what it comes down to is if you value your life and your plane you will seek out the person most qualified on a T18 to check you out. There is a vast amount of experience represented on this forum.I thank all who contribute to make this forum what it is.
Brian


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James Grahn
 Post subject: Re: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 10:11 am 
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Yeah. What Bob said. The insurance companies are the ones who require checkouts or minimum number of hours dual before solo etc., not the FAA. We have several CFIs on this forum who happen to fly Thorps.
Cubes


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SHIPCHIEF
 Post subject: Re: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Sat May 24, 2014 11:45 am 
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Quote:
"One doesn't need a "checkout' by anyone to operate a non-complex, non-high performance airplane. If one has the proper Class, Single Engine Land, on their Pilot Certificate and Endorsement, Tailwheel in their logbook, then they are good to go."

I went this route. I wouldn't recomend it. Later, at Jerry VanGrunsven's insistance, I went to VAN's trainer Mike Seager for break in prior to my first flight of my RV-8. That was much better. Also, it was fun. Mike raised an eyebrow when I arrived in the T-18 for training in an RV-7. :)) He has a good program and the over all experience was positive. I was in much better shape after the first flight in my RV-8 than I was after my first flight in the T-18.
In hindsight, I would have been better off with some training.

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Ryan Allen
 Post subject: Re: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Sat May 24, 2014 2:40 pm 
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would you be interested in expounding on the differences of the flight and landing characteristics?


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SHIPCHIEF
 Post subject: Re: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Sat May 24, 2014 7:17 pm 
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That's a tough question. ???
The RV-8 is heavier with a bigger wing. I would say the stall speed and approach speed to landing is similar, although I fly final a bit faster in the 8 and use full flaps. I have 16 hours on the 8, so I'm no expert.
They fly similar except the rudder inputs are different to keep the ball centered in turns. No suprise there, the T-18 is short, the RV-8 is longer. Similarly the pitch reponse is slower in the 8.
The T-18 is snug, before I 'lost' 25 pounds, I had to squirm in. The RV-8 is roomy, I slide around on the seat to get centered before I land.
My T-18 has the original airfoil with 6"x3/8" stall strips. In a stall, the left wing drops. It's leading edge is thinner than the right wing, especially at the tip, where the right wing has a landing light. Also I'm sitting on the left side. The wing drop is less with one notch of flaps, more with full flaps, so I land it with the flaps in the first notch. I added 2 small "Hall" vortex generators ahead of the inboard ends of the ailerons to reduce the wing drop and improve the control after it. The stall recovery in a power off stall, if done with minimal input (lift wing, slightly lower nose) can leave you in a secondary stall, fully controlled and falling like a piano, about 2000 fpm. Add throttle and the wings hook right up and begin a strong climb. The airfoil on the RV-8 stalls different, less abrupt. I don't have enough experience to add detail.
Because the T-18 fuel tank is ahead of the CG, landing with low fuel means landing with aft CG, and can be pitch sensitive. If I'm tired after a long flight, it can get ugly. My T-18 tracks straight initially on landing, but as it slows thru about 45 MPH it is harder to keep on track (Left / Right) worst about 35 and better as it slows thru 25? I switched from the Maul tail wheel to the Trusty tail spring with Vince's flyboy wheel assembly. That change improved landings, but seems bouncy on roll out over rough grass. Could be the softer spring rate of the stinger spring compared to the heavier leaf spring?
The RV-8 tracks well on landing, and is easier than the T-18. I have not flown it near aft CG yet.
The T-18 has a short control stick that takes very little movement, The 8 has a taller stick that takes more movement. Both are fine. Both have sensitive brakes, that are used carefully but respond very well when called upon.
Your question is a good one that I cannot fully answer. I intend to keep the T-18 and continue to explore the differences and similarities. It will be flown regularly, as I'm changing the engine in the RV-8, I just can't get comfortable with my Mazda turbo rotary engine. I have an IVO-360 enigine from a Brantly B2B that I'm converting, and the 8 will be out of service for a few months.

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Scott Emery
EAA Chapter 326
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Ryan Allen
 Post subject: Re: Checkouts....
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2014 6:35 am 
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that's good stuff scott. thanks.


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